The Intolerable Burden

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Transcript

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In the autumn of 1965, sharecroppers Mae Bertha and Matthew Carter enrolled the youngest eight of their thirteen children in the public schools of Drew, Mississippi. Their decision to send the children to the formerly all white schools was in response to a 'freedom of choice' plan. The plan was designed by the Drew school board to place the district in compliance with the provisions of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, essential since without compliance, the district would no longer be eligible for financial support from the Federal government. Given the prevailing attitudes, Blacks were not expected to choose white schools. This proved true for all but the Carters.

THE INTOLERABLE BURDEN places the Carter's commitment to obtaining a quality education in context, by examining the conditions of segregation prior to 1965, the hardships the family faced during desegregation, and the massive white resistance, which led to resegregation.

In the epilogue, the film poses the dilemma of 'education vs. incarceration' - a particular threat to youth of color.

While the town of Drew is geographically isolated, the patterns of segregation, desegregation, and resegregation are increasingly apparent throughout public education systems in the United States.

'Required viewing!'-Southern Changes

'Exceptional! Spellbinding! An essential purchase for all libraries.'-Catholic Library World

'Editor's Choice! * * * * (Four Stars!) Highly Recommended! Excellent! Combines interviews... most poignantly and eloquently, Mae Bertha herself), compelling black-and-white archival footage, and additional commentary from other activists, the white school secretary, and fellow white students to limn a powerful portrait...The film makes it clear that Drew is a microcosm for what is happening in many other places.'-Video Librarian

'The film vividly demonstrates historical agency and the personal and institutional impact of historical events, as blacks and whites from the Delta reflect on their experiences with de-segregation and re-segregation. The Carter children's subsequent divergent paths suggest the benefits and costs of the burden of their experience.'-American Historical Association

'Highly Recommended! A powerful oral history and visual record of... the visible signs of racism, the effect on individuals and institutions, and the consequences of personal and administrative decisions on the lives of the people involved and the society as a whole.' -Educational Media Reviews Online

'One of the best video histories of the desegregation era ever produced. An excellent example of how documentaries on the 1960s should be done. Captures on film what it means to be a courageous individual. The magisterial clarity with which this dramatic story... is told keeps the viewer's attention throughout. Indispensable to students... because the actual participants take center stage - one would be hard pressed to find this caliber of work in any other single story of this era.'-Professor Curtis Austin, University of Southern Mississippi, Assistant Director of the Center for Oral History

'Asks us to reconsider our emphasis on so-called 'correction' over actual education. The failures of the former are obvious; isn't it time we tried the latter?'-Julian Bond, former Georgia Assemblyman and currently a Distinguished Scholar in Residence at American University

'The real story here is the effects of segregation, desegregation, and resegregation and how society has failed to educate all its children. Recommended!'-Library Journal

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Main credits

Prince, Chea (film director)
Prince, Chea (film editor)
Curry, Constance (film producer)

Other credits

Music supervisor, Thom Watson.

MARC Record See Worldcat record

Keywords

education; civil rights; teaching; schooling; film; video; documentary; DVD; segregation; desegregation; resegregation; Drew; Mississippi; Civil Rights Act of 1964; public schools; education vs. incarceration; "The Intolerable Burden"; Icarus Films; ,doc; history; sociss

WEBVTT

00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:37.310 align:middle line:90%

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I know and my husband knows
there\'s nothing you can do in

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the United States without
education.

00:00:51.850 --> 00:00:53.570 align:middle line:84%
You\'re just like a fish
out of the water.

00:00:53.570 --> 00:00:56.750 align:middle line:90%

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How long can that fish live
out of that water?

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We are out in the
cotton field.

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This big, nice, yellow shiny
buses pass us when we\'re in

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the fields.

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And white kids was on them.

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We\'d be in the field and say,
why are they in school and

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we\'re in the cotton field?

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I think it came down to a lot
of things that happened.

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And a lot of changes that took
place was because the young

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people and the children
were the ones that

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carried that burden.

00:01:25.390 --> 00:01:27.900 align:middle line:90%

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[MUSIC PLAYING]

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In Drew, Mississippi, which was
such a terrible place for

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me as a kid, they had
two policeman.

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One of them was called the
Good Rockin\' Floyd.

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And the other one was called
Good Rockin\' Flemmins.

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And the Good Rockin\' part was
that they enjoyed, apparently,

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beating up on people with those
billy clubs they had.

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Flemmins took the oppression and
the threat and the fear to

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a new level.

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And these are stories.

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We certainly weren\'t
in town to see it.

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He used to carry
pliers around.

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And men who had goatees black
men who had goatees

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he\'d pull them out.

00:03:39.420 --> 00:03:41.890 align:middle line:90%

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Black women who came to town
who were pregnant, visibly

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pregnant, they\'d punch her in
the belly and say, I don\'t

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want to see you on these streets
again until after that

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kid is born.

00:03:51.040 --> 00:03:53.170 align:middle line:90%
So you couldn\'t come to town.

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You couldn\'t come to town.

00:03:54.420 --> 00:04:14.920 align:middle line:90%

00:04:14.920 --> 00:04:17.939 align:middle line:84%
You guys don\'t understand the
connection that we have with

00:04:17.939 --> 00:04:19.730 align:middle line:90%
the colored people.

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In other words, we
work with them.

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And they work with us.

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And we aren\'t going to take them
and push them somewhere

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just because we could do it.

00:04:29.620 --> 00:04:31.380 align:middle line:84%
You tell these people just what
I\'ve been telling them

00:04:31.380 --> 00:04:32.770 align:middle line:90%
right here.

00:04:32.770 --> 00:04:34.810 align:middle line:84%
Well, Henry\'s been your
friend for years.

00:04:34.810 --> 00:04:35.920 align:middle line:90%
Yes.

00:04:35.920 --> 00:04:38.300 align:middle line:84%
And we worked more of them than
anybody in this country.

00:04:38.300 --> 00:04:39.430 align:middle line:90%
Yes, sir.

00:04:39.430 --> 00:04:40.000 align:middle line:90%
Sure have.

00:04:40.000 --> 00:04:41.520 align:middle line:90%
That\'s right.

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If you get hungry, then we gave
you something to eat.

00:04:43.320 --> 00:04:43.880 align:middle line:90%
Don\'t we, Bill?

00:04:43.880 --> 00:04:44.590 align:middle line:90%
Yes, sir.

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If you got in trouble, who would
you go to, the whites or

00:04:46.365 --> 00:04:47.895 align:middle line:90%
the blacks?

00:04:47.895 --> 00:04:49.827 align:middle line:90%
Tell the truth, now.

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[LAUGHS]

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The white.

00:04:52.620 --> 00:04:55.327 align:middle line:84%
--put him on the spot so there
ain\'t no colored folks here.

00:04:55.327 --> 00:04:56.040 align:middle line:90%
And we don\'t want them.

00:04:56.040 --> 00:04:57.290 align:middle line:90%
[INAUDIBLE].

00:04:57.290 --> 00:04:59.365 align:middle line:90%

00:04:59.365 --> 00:05:00.615 align:middle line:90%
Yeah.

00:05:00.615 --> 00:05:03.180 align:middle line:90%

00:05:03.180 --> 00:05:06.850 align:middle line:84%
But is there anybody here that
wouldn\'t [INAUDIBLE]?

00:05:06.850 --> 00:05:08.100 align:middle line:90%
No.

00:05:08.100 --> 00:05:10.370 align:middle line:90%

00:05:10.370 --> 00:05:11.520 align:middle line:90%
There used to be a saying.

00:05:11.520 --> 00:05:13.670 align:middle line:84%
And I\'ve heard it
more than once.

00:05:13.670 --> 00:05:17.480 align:middle line:84%
That if you ever could be black
on a Saturday night, for

00:05:17.480 --> 00:05:20.680 align:middle line:84%
one Saturday night, you\'d never
want to be white again.

00:05:20.680 --> 00:05:22.610 align:middle line:90%
Now what does that say to you?

00:05:22.610 --> 00:05:25.340 align:middle line:84%
That says to you that they have
a wonderful time being

00:05:25.340 --> 00:05:27.960 align:middle line:90%
who they are.

00:05:27.960 --> 00:05:36.900 align:middle line:84%
And they don\'t want to be a
conglomerated amalgamation of

00:05:36.900 --> 00:05:38.150 align:middle line:90%
pale colors.

00:05:38.150 --> 00:05:40.280 align:middle line:90%

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And I think they are
a happy race.

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They are happy being
what they are.

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And I think white people are
happy the way they are.

00:05:54.260 --> 00:05:55.660 align:middle line:84%
And I think you should
be left alone.

00:05:55.660 --> 00:06:01.504 align:middle line:90%

00:06:01.504 --> 00:06:03.170 align:middle line:84%
I started working when
I was about six

00:06:03.170 --> 00:06:06.470 align:middle line:90%
years old in the field.

00:06:06.470 --> 00:06:09.250 align:middle line:84%
And many times there was, like,
four or five of us kids

00:06:09.250 --> 00:06:11.490 align:middle line:84%
in the field, you know, went
to go to the field.

00:06:11.490 --> 00:06:13.850 align:middle line:84%
My mama and my daddy,
you know.

00:06:13.850 --> 00:06:19.420 align:middle line:84%
And then we would work from sun
up to sundown, six days a

00:06:19.420 --> 00:06:20.770 align:middle line:90%
week many times.

00:06:20.770 --> 00:06:24.205 align:middle line:84%
And in the year you didn\'t make
anything, for those many

00:06:24.205 --> 00:06:26.685 align:middle line:84%
people working hard
work, labor.

00:06:26.685 --> 00:06:30.300 align:middle line:90%

00:06:30.300 --> 00:06:34.640 align:middle line:84%
Many times you hear white people
say to you, you know,

00:06:34.640 --> 00:06:36.240 align:middle line:90%
just let the past alone.

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Or they\'ll talk about, I\'m sick
and tired of people being

00:06:38.830 --> 00:06:39.340 align:middle line:90%
on the welfare.

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And talking about taking
care of able bodies.

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Just think of how many bodies
I took care of at six years

00:06:47.830 --> 00:06:49.210 align:middle line:90%
old, you know.

00:06:49.210 --> 00:06:53.970 align:middle line:84%
Take fives days a week,
six days a week.

00:06:53.970 --> 00:06:58.180 align:middle line:84%
And then Sunday, go
home and wash.

00:06:58.180 --> 00:06:59.900 align:middle line:84%
That\'s in the fall when
we getting in

00:06:59.900 --> 00:07:02.511 align:middle line:90%
cotton picking time.

00:07:02.511 --> 00:07:08.520 align:middle line:84%
And in the summer time, we
chop cotton from Monday

00:07:08.520 --> 00:07:12.110 align:middle line:90%
morning to Friday night.

00:07:12.110 --> 00:07:17.210 align:middle line:84%
And well, we didn\'t
get any money.

00:07:17.210 --> 00:07:19.420 align:middle line:90%
Was no money in the deal.

00:07:19.420 --> 00:07:22.310 align:middle line:84%
When you sharecrop,
you gave 50%.

00:07:22.310 --> 00:07:24.520 align:middle line:90%
You got 50%.

00:07:24.520 --> 00:07:28.040 align:middle line:84%
We would have 30 bales of
cotton somewhere in that

00:07:28.040 --> 00:07:30.960 align:middle line:84%
neighborhood that we would
actually do all

00:07:30.960 --> 00:07:32.800 align:middle line:90%
the work for it.

00:07:32.800 --> 00:07:40.390 align:middle line:84%
But the landlord got the money
from 15 bales than we did.

00:07:40.390 --> 00:07:44.210 align:middle line:84%
And the way we survived, you
got a furnish during the

00:07:44.210 --> 00:07:45.350 align:middle line:90%
summer months.

00:07:45.350 --> 00:07:49.010 align:middle line:84%
I think it started along in
spring, maybe March or April,

00:07:49.010 --> 00:07:52.660 align:middle line:84%
after you had spent what
you got in the fall.

00:07:52.660 --> 00:07:56.150 align:middle line:84%
And my daddy always tried to let
that furnish be as low as

00:07:56.150 --> 00:07:59.530 align:middle line:84%
he could because you owed
that back in the fall.

00:07:59.530 --> 00:08:03.060 align:middle line:84%
And at the end of the year, when
it\'s time for them to do

00:08:03.060 --> 00:08:06.590 align:middle line:84%
a settlement with you, every
time you go, they have a

00:08:06.590 --> 00:08:06.950 align:middle line:90%
little ledger.

00:08:06.950 --> 00:08:09.960 align:middle line:84%
And they tell you what you
owe, and all of this.

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And you end up there until the
white man say, well, you

00:08:14.340 --> 00:08:16.360 align:middle line:84%
didn\'t clear anything
this year.

00:08:16.360 --> 00:08:20.560 align:middle line:84%
Almost everybody who I met and
went to school with had the

00:08:20.560 --> 00:08:22.310 align:middle line:90%
same experience.

00:08:22.310 --> 00:08:23.680 align:middle line:84%
Nobody came in and said,
we cleared a

00:08:23.680 --> 00:08:25.120 align:middle line:90%
lot of money yesterday.

00:08:25.120 --> 00:08:27.570 align:middle line:84%
My daddy and mama got
a big settlement.

00:08:27.570 --> 00:08:29.210 align:middle line:84%
You mean, it just wasn\'t
happening in the

00:08:29.210 --> 00:08:30.460 align:middle line:90%
delta where we were.

00:08:30.460 --> 00:08:38.770 align:middle line:90%

00:08:38.770 --> 00:08:44.620 align:middle line:84%
In this area of Mississippi,
most of the blacks who wanted

00:08:44.620 --> 00:08:47.830 align:middle line:90%
to own or have anything moved.

00:08:47.830 --> 00:08:52.510 align:middle line:84%
Within my own family, most of
our relatives moved north.

00:08:52.510 --> 00:08:55.850 align:middle line:84%
So consequently, the blacks who
were left here were the

00:08:55.850 --> 00:09:01.350 align:middle line:84%
ones who were from the
field workers.

00:09:01.350 --> 00:09:05.930 align:middle line:84%
And even when I was younger, I
knew that we did not go to

00:09:05.930 --> 00:09:09.336 align:middle line:84%
school as many months out
of the year as whites.

00:09:09.336 --> 00:09:13.840 align:middle line:84%
Black kids didn\'t have the
opportunity to school at all

00:09:13.840 --> 00:09:17.070 align:middle line:84%
because they had to pick cotton
and chop cotton to help

00:09:17.070 --> 00:09:17.790 align:middle line:90%
support the family.

00:09:17.790 --> 00:09:20.804 align:middle line:84%
They got a late start
in school.

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My uncle was nine before
he started first grade.

00:09:25.020 --> 00:09:28.700 align:middle line:84%
So a lot of black kids were
20, 21 when they graduated

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back then because they got
a late start in school.

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The education piece was approved
to have what they

00:09:37.370 --> 00:09:39.380 align:middle line:90%
called split-session schools.

00:09:39.380 --> 00:09:44.630 align:middle line:84%
So that our schooling was
squeezed in between the

00:09:44.630 --> 00:09:47.240 align:middle line:84%
cultivation and harvest
of crops.

00:09:47.240 --> 00:09:50.820 align:middle line:84%
We had to use the old
used books that the

00:09:50.820 --> 00:09:52.560 align:middle line:90%
white kids were using.

00:09:52.560 --> 00:09:57.120 align:middle line:84%
They would get the
current books.

00:09:57.120 --> 00:09:59.170 align:middle line:84%
And then we\'d have to
use their old books.

00:09:59.170 --> 00:10:01.170 align:middle line:84%
Pages would be missing
out of them.

00:10:01.170 --> 00:10:03.350 align:middle line:84%
The word nigger would
be written in them.

00:10:03.350 --> 00:10:07.465 align:middle line:84%
And don\'t care how
old that book.

00:10:07.465 --> 00:10:11.110 align:middle line:90%

00:10:11.110 --> 00:10:14.130 align:middle line:84%
So many names in that book so
you can\'t have no room for the

00:10:14.130 --> 00:10:16.950 align:middle line:90%
writing of more names.

00:10:16.950 --> 00:10:20.780 align:middle line:90%
You got to pay the damage.

00:10:20.780 --> 00:10:26.450 align:middle line:84%
In the segregated school,
I see us being

00:10:26.450 --> 00:10:29.200 align:middle line:90%
taught by sincere people.

00:10:29.200 --> 00:10:33.900 align:middle line:84%
But maybe not with the right
equipment that was across town

00:10:33.900 --> 00:10:35.180 align:middle line:90%
at the white school.

00:10:35.180 --> 00:10:39.610 align:middle line:84%
But we had people that was
sincere about us learning.

00:10:39.610 --> 00:10:41.660 align:middle line:90%
And we learned basic things.

00:10:41.660 --> 00:10:46.081 align:middle line:84%
And they made sure that we
got the basic things.

00:10:46.081 --> 00:10:48.750 align:middle line:84%
For the summer, kids
had so far to walk.

00:10:48.750 --> 00:10:51.650 align:middle line:84%
And they didn\'t have proper
clothes when it was cold.

00:10:51.650 --> 00:10:53.530 align:middle line:90%
They probably didn\'t come.

00:10:53.530 --> 00:10:58.410 align:middle line:84%
Other parents just kept them
home to do anything.

00:10:58.410 --> 00:11:00.880 align:middle line:84%
I remember bypassing
them on the bus.

00:11:00.880 --> 00:11:03.500 align:middle line:84%
And there again, I asked my
mama, why are they walking?

00:11:03.500 --> 00:11:06.770 align:middle line:84%
And she said, well, they
don\'t allow black

00:11:06.770 --> 00:11:10.270 align:middle line:90%
children to have buses.

00:11:10.270 --> 00:11:16.460 align:middle line:84%
At that time, in the prejudiced
way, they really

00:11:16.460 --> 00:11:19.350 align:middle line:84%
didn\'t want the blacks
to get educated.

00:11:19.350 --> 00:11:22.980 align:middle line:84%
We were taught that if you
were caught educated, you

00:11:22.980 --> 00:11:24.230 align:middle line:90%
would be killed.

00:11:24.230 --> 00:11:39.782 align:middle line:90%

00:11:39.782 --> 00:11:40.278 align:middle line:90%
What do you want?

00:11:40.278 --> 00:11:41.270 align:middle line:90%
Freedom!

00:11:41.270 --> 00:11:42.262 align:middle line:90%
What do you want?

00:11:42.262 --> 00:11:43.254 align:middle line:90%
Freedom!

00:11:43.254 --> 00:11:43.750 align:middle line:90%
What do you want?

00:11:43.750 --> 00:11:44.742 align:middle line:90%
Freedom!

00:11:44.742 --> 00:11:45.238 align:middle line:90%
When do you want it?

00:11:45.238 --> 00:11:46.230 align:middle line:90%
Now!

00:11:46.230 --> 00:11:46.726 align:middle line:90%
When do you want it?

00:11:46.726 --> 00:11:47.222 align:middle line:90%
Now!

00:11:47.222 --> 00:11:48.214 align:middle line:90%
When do you want it?

00:11:48.214 --> 00:11:50.198 align:middle line:90%
Now!

00:11:50.198 --> 00:12:20.110 align:middle line:90%
[MUSIC PLAYING]

00:12:20.110 --> 00:12:25.430 align:middle line:84%
We had in the height of the
civil rights movement to rise

00:12:25.430 --> 00:12:32.000 align:middle line:84%
in rural Mississippi, and
perhaps the meanest section of

00:12:32.000 --> 00:12:34.370 align:middle line:90%
the entire state.

00:12:34.370 --> 00:12:39.800 align:middle line:84%
A courageous black woman named
Mae Bertha, born on a

00:12:39.800 --> 00:12:47.760 align:middle line:84%
plantation herself and living
there in the \'50s and the \'60s

00:12:47.760 --> 00:12:51.960 align:middle line:84%
in conditions that were
tantamount to what they were

00:12:51.960 --> 00:12:56.660 align:middle line:84%
like that brought on
the Civil War.

00:12:56.660 --> 00:13:02.770 align:middle line:84%
There was very little change
between the slavery of 1860

00:13:02.770 --> 00:13:07.440 align:middle line:84%
and the denial of opportunities
upon blacks in

00:13:07.440 --> 00:13:12.130 align:middle line:84%
the 1960s, very little
difference.

00:13:12.130 --> 00:13:17.490 align:middle line:84%
I dreamed that one day we would
leave that plantation,

00:13:17.490 --> 00:13:20.560 align:middle line:90%
leave that farm.

00:13:20.560 --> 00:13:24.120 align:middle line:84%
And the way we was going to
leave it, we were going to

00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:28.765 align:middle line:84%
work real hard in the field,
do without, send

00:13:28.765 --> 00:13:30.680 align:middle line:90%
the children to school.

00:13:30.680 --> 00:13:34.390 align:middle line:84%
And so when they get their
education, they begin

00:13:34.390 --> 00:13:35.320 align:middle line:90%
to leave the farm.

00:13:35.320 --> 00:13:39.990 align:middle line:84%
And when the last one leaves,
we\'ll leave, too.

00:13:39.990 --> 00:13:44.690 align:middle line:84%
Mae Berta Carter lived on the
plantation next to us.

00:13:44.690 --> 00:13:47.640 align:middle line:90%
And her life had been similar.

00:13:47.640 --> 00:13:51.440 align:middle line:84%
The same kinds of experiences
of growing up poor in bare

00:13:51.440 --> 00:13:55.670 align:middle line:84%
feet and playing in the dirt
and struggling to survive.

00:13:55.670 --> 00:14:00.830 align:middle line:84%
With similar orientation in
terms of parents who really

00:14:00.830 --> 00:14:05.510 align:middle line:84%
understand that this process
they were in of being

00:14:05.510 --> 00:14:08.460 align:middle line:90%
oppressed by greedy and selfish

00:14:08.460 --> 00:14:10.990 align:middle line:90%
plantation owners was temporary.

00:14:10.990 --> 00:14:15.900 align:middle line:84%
And there was going to be some
cataclysmic event that moved

00:14:15.900 --> 00:14:17.720 align:middle line:90%
us to the top rail.

00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:20.220 align:middle line:84%
And what we had to do was
prepare ourselves to be at

00:14:20.220 --> 00:14:21.140 align:middle line:90%
this top rail.

00:14:21.140 --> 00:14:26.300 align:middle line:84%
You can\'t let people
make you feel bad.

00:14:26.300 --> 00:14:29.740 align:middle line:90%
Don\'t let them get you down.

00:14:29.740 --> 00:14:30.730 align:middle line:90%
That\'s the main thing.

00:14:30.730 --> 00:14:33.320 align:middle line:90%
Don\'t let nobody get you down.

00:14:33.320 --> 00:14:36.871 align:middle line:84%
Especially when you\'re not
doing nothing wrong.

00:14:36.871 --> 00:14:38.680 align:middle line:84%
I went to Sunday school
last Sunday.

00:14:38.680 --> 00:14:41.200 align:middle line:84%
In there was, in the
Sunday school, a

00:14:41.200 --> 00:14:44.050 align:middle line:90%
character named Deborah.

00:14:44.050 --> 00:14:47.280 align:middle line:84%
And she was the judge in that
particular time with the

00:14:47.280 --> 00:14:48.550 align:middle line:90%
Israelites.

00:14:48.550 --> 00:14:52.700 align:middle line:84%
And she had the responsibility
of kind of guiding, and

00:14:52.700 --> 00:14:54.330 align:middle line:84%
overseeing, and working
with them.

00:14:54.330 --> 00:14:59.580 align:middle line:84%
And I think Mae Berta Carter can
be looked upon as a judge,

00:14:59.580 --> 00:15:04.570 align:middle line:84%
or one of those God-sent persons
who were there to work

00:15:04.570 --> 00:15:12.030 align:middle line:84%
with kind of as a motivator and
a provider of inspiration

00:15:12.030 --> 00:15:12.770 align:middle line:90%
for the community.

00:15:12.770 --> 00:15:16.030 align:middle line:84%
She certainly was one
of a lot of courage.

00:15:16.030 --> 00:15:18.310 align:middle line:84%
To do the things that she did
when she did it in Drew,

00:15:18.310 --> 00:15:22.860 align:middle line:84%
Mississippi, putting her family
through the trials and

00:15:22.860 --> 00:15:26.160 align:middle line:84%
tribulations that she put them
through by saying that she

00:15:26.160 --> 00:15:30.350 align:middle line:84%
wanted them to receive a
good quality education.

00:15:30.350 --> 00:15:33.470 align:middle line:84%
And she could look at the Drew
public school system and see

00:15:33.470 --> 00:15:36.305 align:middle line:84%
that you had two school systems,
one that was black

00:15:36.305 --> 00:15:38.380 align:middle line:90%
and one that was white.

00:15:38.380 --> 00:15:43.180 align:middle line:84%
And the black school system
wasn\'t adequate.

00:15:43.180 --> 00:15:47.190 align:middle line:84%
Or there was so many inequities
that existed

00:15:47.190 --> 00:15:48.570 align:middle line:90%
compared to the white school.

00:15:48.570 --> 00:15:52.510 align:middle line:84%
And she was willing to cross
that line and say that she was

00:15:52.510 --> 00:15:55.610 align:middle line:84%
going to send her children
to the white school.

00:15:55.610 --> 00:15:59.540 align:middle line:84%
Mae Bertha, much more than my
mother, who was passive and

00:15:59.540 --> 00:16:03.950 align:middle line:84%
who had been beaten down by
life, who was bright, but had

00:16:03.950 --> 00:16:08.900 align:middle line:84%
had her brilliance and her
potential stymied by the

00:16:08.900 --> 00:16:10.330 align:middle line:90%
plantation system.

00:16:10.330 --> 00:16:16.040 align:middle line:84%
Or daddy who you\'d call a native
intelligence but had

00:16:16.040 --> 00:16:18.500 align:middle line:84%
never had the opportunity
to have an education.

00:16:18.500 --> 00:16:23.176 align:middle line:84%
Mae Bertha represented the
best of all of that.

00:16:23.176 --> 00:16:25.500 align:middle line:90%
Her spirit was never broken.

00:16:25.500 --> 00:16:27.990 align:middle line:84%
She had come out of the
same oppression.

00:16:27.990 --> 00:16:33.890 align:middle line:84%
But she had been taught, or had
observed and had decided

00:16:33.890 --> 00:16:36.830 align:middle line:84%
that she was as important
as the white folks.

00:16:36.830 --> 00:16:44.420 align:middle line:84%
My family\'s oppression had led
us to somehow believe that we

00:16:44.420 --> 00:16:46.420 align:middle line:84%
weren\'t as good as
white folks.

00:16:46.420 --> 00:16:49.810 align:middle line:84%
That we didn\'t have something
that they had.

00:16:49.810 --> 00:16:52.680 align:middle line:90%

00:16:52.680 --> 00:16:57.100 align:middle line:84%
We were pretty much like we
were being treated, less

00:16:57.100 --> 00:17:01.030 align:middle line:84%
worthy, worth less,
and all that.

00:17:01.030 --> 00:17:03.440 align:middle line:90%
Mae Bertha had none of that.

00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:06.400 align:middle line:84%
The black community has grown
up, systematically in this

00:17:06.400 --> 00:17:10.740 align:middle line:84%
state, in the culture
of powerlessness.

00:17:10.740 --> 00:17:16.609 align:middle line:84%
In which it takes an enormous
amount of courage, and

00:17:16.609 --> 00:17:22.900 align:middle line:84%
sticktoitiveness, and
risk-taking to challenge that

00:17:22.900 --> 00:17:25.480 align:middle line:84%
which you\'ve been told you
have no right to take for

00:17:25.480 --> 00:17:29.300 align:middle line:84%
granted, in fact, you have
the right to have, and

00:17:29.300 --> 00:17:32.110 align:middle line:90%
to demand it anyway.

00:17:32.110 --> 00:17:34.210 align:middle line:84%
And that\'s what Mae
Berta Carter did.

00:17:34.210 --> 00:17:38.430 align:middle line:84%
She said, I\'m not taking no for
an answer, nor am I going

00:17:38.430 --> 00:17:43.490 align:middle line:84%
to accept any which framework
that you suggest is

00:17:43.490 --> 00:17:47.000 align:middle line:84%
appropriate for my children
to go to school.

00:17:47.000 --> 00:17:49.970 align:middle line:84%
And I remember her telling me
about how the freedom of

00:17:49.970 --> 00:17:53.850 align:middle line:84%
choice was supposed to work
originally as the initial

00:17:53.850 --> 00:17:56.840 align:middle line:84%
design coming out of the
federal court orders.

00:17:56.840 --> 00:18:02.920 align:middle line:84%
It was expected, rooted in the
culture, that the whites would

00:18:02.920 --> 00:18:05.940 align:middle line:84%
pick the white schools, and
the blacks would pick the

00:18:05.940 --> 00:18:09.970 align:middle line:84%
black schools, and that no one
would have the temerity, the

00:18:09.970 --> 00:18:13.530 align:middle line:84%
audacity, to pick
a white school.

00:18:13.530 --> 00:18:17.940 align:middle line:84%
That\'s what Miss Carter
did for her children.

00:18:17.940 --> 00:18:23.710 align:middle line:84%
That cracked the
cultural norm.

00:18:23.710 --> 00:18:29.420 align:middle line:84%
Somebody had to do
it, somebody.

00:18:29.420 --> 00:18:33.480 align:middle line:84%
It was within them,
it was in me.

00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:36.240 align:middle line:84%
And we couldn\'t get
around doing it.

00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:38.680 align:middle line:90%
Somebody had to do it.

00:18:38.680 --> 00:18:40.780 align:middle line:90%
Now we had five white men.

00:18:40.780 --> 00:18:43.504 align:middle line:90%

00:18:43.504 --> 00:18:45.800 align:middle line:84%
And both men were from
both schools.

00:18:45.800 --> 00:18:49.090 align:middle line:90%

00:18:49.090 --> 00:18:51.490 align:middle line:84%
And they were sitting there
trying to get around

00:18:51.490 --> 00:18:53.980 align:middle line:90%
integration.

00:18:53.980 --> 00:18:57.030 align:middle line:84%
Sitting there trying to see how
they can still get this

00:18:57.030 --> 00:19:00.760 align:middle line:84%
money and black people
would have the

00:19:00.760 --> 00:19:02.750 align:middle line:90%
opportunity to enjoy it.

00:19:02.750 --> 00:19:04.000 align:middle line:84%
That\'s what they were
sitting there for.

00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:07.940 align:middle line:90%

00:19:07.940 --> 00:19:12.590 align:middle line:84%
So you came up with this
freedom of choice.

00:19:12.590 --> 00:19:15.360 align:middle line:84%
Because they think they know
black folks so well.

00:19:15.360 --> 00:19:17.950 align:middle line:90%

00:19:17.950 --> 00:19:21.725 align:middle line:84%
And black folks would
not accept

00:19:21.725 --> 00:19:24.060 align:middle line:90%
their freedom of choice.

00:19:24.060 --> 00:19:29.310 align:middle line:84%
They are just going back to
their school, they call it.

00:19:29.310 --> 00:19:32.177 align:middle line:84%
And so they wouldn\'t have
nobody in two schools.

00:19:32.177 --> 00:19:51.063 align:middle line:90%

00:19:51.063 --> 00:19:56.800 align:middle line:84%
The summer of \'65, when I was
eight years old, I guess, my

00:19:56.800 --> 00:19:58.430 align:middle line:90%
mother was gone off.

00:19:58.430 --> 00:19:59.930 align:middle line:84%
She was leaving for
the summer.

00:19:59.930 --> 00:20:01.590 align:middle line:84%
And a letter came to the
house, I\'m told.

00:20:01.590 --> 00:20:03.700 align:middle line:90%
I can\'t even remember this.

00:20:03.700 --> 00:20:08.990 align:middle line:84%
But I was told that a letter
came to the house saying that

00:20:08.990 --> 00:20:10.810 align:middle line:84%
you could get to choose which
schools you wanted to send

00:20:10.810 --> 00:20:11.730 align:middle line:90%
your children to.

00:20:11.730 --> 00:20:15.050 align:middle line:84%
So we opened up the letter and
saw the papers in there.

00:20:15.050 --> 00:20:16.270 align:middle line:90%
And we read it.

00:20:16.270 --> 00:20:20.720 align:middle line:84%
And we can decide that it was
going to be a good thing not

00:20:20.720 --> 00:20:21.970 align:middle line:90%
to go to the all-white school.

00:20:21.970 --> 00:20:24.330 align:middle line:90%

00:20:24.330 --> 00:20:25.460 align:middle line:90%
And that white--

00:20:25.460 --> 00:20:29.266 align:middle line:84%
leaving, just to me,
it wasn\'t right.

00:20:29.266 --> 00:20:31.480 align:middle line:84%
I thought the schools should
be integrated.

00:20:31.480 --> 00:20:33.350 align:middle line:84%
There just shouldn\'t be
an all-white school

00:20:33.350 --> 00:20:34.190 align:middle line:90%
and all-black school.

00:20:34.190 --> 00:20:36.640 align:middle line:84%
My family was part of the
Civil Rights Movement.

00:20:36.640 --> 00:20:44.140 align:middle line:84%
Because earlier, two sister was
already thrown in jail for

00:20:44.140 --> 00:20:46.950 align:middle line:90%
marching in Jackson.

00:20:46.950 --> 00:20:50.280 align:middle line:84%
And I\'m not too sure, I think
it had to do with both race

00:20:50.280 --> 00:20:52.200 align:middle line:90%
and accommodation.

00:20:52.200 --> 00:20:53.660 align:middle line:84%
So we was all right,
we was all ready to

00:20:53.660 --> 00:20:54.480 align:middle line:90%
participate in it.

00:20:54.480 --> 00:20:58.870 align:middle line:84%
We would sing and talk about a
change and how we were going

00:20:58.870 --> 00:21:00.540 align:middle line:84%
to change Mississippi,
how Mississippi

00:21:00.540 --> 00:21:01.380 align:middle line:90%
was going to change.

00:21:01.380 --> 00:21:03.790 align:middle line:84%
And I thought, this will be a
first step towards changing

00:21:03.790 --> 00:21:06.926 align:middle line:84%
Mississippi, and Sunflower
county, and Drew.

00:21:06.926 --> 00:21:09.471 align:middle line:84%
And I was going to the
all-white school.

00:21:09.471 --> 00:21:38.990 align:middle line:90%
[MUSIC PLAYING]

00:21:38.990 --> 00:21:43.360 align:middle line:84%
I didn\'t understand what they
wanted at Drew High School.

00:21:43.360 --> 00:21:46.570 align:middle line:84%
And I couldn\'t understand, since
going to school is so

00:21:46.570 --> 00:21:51.140 align:middle line:84%
much more than attending
classes, I couldn\'t think that

00:21:51.140 --> 00:21:54.970 align:middle line:84%
what they were going through
would be a good thing and part

00:21:54.970 --> 00:21:57.900 align:middle line:84%
of what you\'d want to remember
in your high school, like

00:21:57.900 --> 00:22:01.990 align:middle line:84%
going to the prom, cheering at
football games, or being in

00:22:01.990 --> 00:22:06.930 align:middle line:84%
the band, or being a part of
that social structure, and

00:22:06.930 --> 00:22:08.530 align:middle line:90%
instead being on the outside.

00:22:08.530 --> 00:22:08.930 align:middle line:90%
You\'re there.

00:22:08.930 --> 00:22:10.000 align:middle line:90%
But you\'re on the outside.

00:22:10.000 --> 00:22:12.860 align:middle line:84%
And you\'re definitely
looking in.

00:22:12.860 --> 00:22:15.150 align:middle line:84%
To me, it was just getting to go
to a better school, getting

00:22:15.150 --> 00:22:16.400 align:middle line:90%
a better education.

00:22:16.400 --> 00:22:19.030 align:middle line:84%
A newer school, doing things
more modern, and

00:22:19.030 --> 00:22:20.280 align:middle line:90%
those kinds of things.

00:22:20.280 --> 00:22:22.860 align:middle line:84%
And it think it felt that
same way to all of us.

00:22:22.860 --> 00:22:23.750 align:middle line:90%
This is something good.

00:22:23.750 --> 00:22:25.000 align:middle line:90%
This is something better.

00:22:25.000 --> 00:22:25.900 align:middle line:90%
It looks prettier.

00:22:25.900 --> 00:22:27.340 align:middle line:90%
The buses are prettier.

00:22:27.340 --> 00:22:28.520 align:middle line:90%
So it was just excitement.

00:22:28.520 --> 00:22:31.740 align:middle line:84%
We were really excited about
doing something better.

00:22:31.740 --> 00:22:36.700 align:middle line:84%
It was a big to do by them
coming to the white school.

00:22:36.700 --> 00:22:39.570 align:middle line:84%
We were still segregated
at the time.

00:22:39.570 --> 00:22:43.380 align:middle line:84%
And their mother and sister
don\'t come in the

00:22:43.380 --> 00:22:44.810 align:middle line:90%
school, Drew High.

00:22:44.810 --> 00:22:48.100 align:middle line:90%

00:22:48.100 --> 00:22:50.930 align:middle line:84%
I personally think it\'s because
she wanted her kids to

00:22:50.930 --> 00:22:52.180 align:middle line:90%
get a better education.

00:22:52.180 --> 00:22:55.560 align:middle line:90%

00:22:55.560 --> 00:22:57.140 align:middle line:84%
I didn\'t think that
at the time.

00:22:57.140 --> 00:23:00.910 align:middle line:84%
I was just like every
other white kid.

00:23:00.910 --> 00:23:02.850 align:middle line:90%
I didn\'t want them there.

00:23:02.850 --> 00:23:06.860 align:middle line:84%
And I treated them very
indifferently.

00:23:06.860 --> 00:23:09.595 align:middle line:84%
They were not will
received at all.

00:23:09.595 --> 00:23:17.974 align:middle line:90%

00:23:17.974 --> 00:23:20.340 align:middle line:84%
The first day they were just
really kind of quiet.

00:23:20.340 --> 00:23:22.520 align:middle line:84%
And they just kept
to themselves.

00:23:22.520 --> 00:23:23.810 align:middle line:90%
They wouldn\'t get close to us.

00:23:23.810 --> 00:23:27.510 align:middle line:84%
And it was like we were invading
them, or invading

00:23:27.510 --> 00:23:31.450 align:middle line:84%
their space, that we were
somewhere we weren\'t supposed

00:23:31.450 --> 00:23:33.310 align:middle line:84%
to be, that we shouldn\'t
have shouldn\'t have

00:23:33.310 --> 00:23:34.340 align:middle line:90%
done what we had done.

00:23:34.340 --> 00:23:35.920 align:middle line:90%
And they were mean.

00:23:35.920 --> 00:23:40.120 align:middle line:84%
I can just remember, you know,
not having any friends, coming

00:23:40.120 --> 00:23:45.890 align:middle line:84%
home every day from school and
telling mama about different

00:23:45.890 --> 00:23:47.090 align:middle line:84%
things that may have
happened to me.

00:23:47.090 --> 00:23:48.790 align:middle line:84%
Like, I didn\'t have
any friends.

00:23:48.790 --> 00:23:53.350 align:middle line:84%
People were calling me names
or throwing spit balls.

00:23:53.350 --> 00:23:55.340 align:middle line:90%
They\'d throw chalk.

00:23:55.340 --> 00:23:56.830 align:middle line:84%
You\'d walk down the hall,
they jumped to the

00:23:56.830 --> 00:23:58.600 align:middle line:90%
other side of the hall.

00:23:58.600 --> 00:24:01.150 align:middle line:90%
I\'ve been pushed, kicked, too.

00:24:01.150 --> 00:24:08.010 align:middle line:84%
And one experience I remember,
I was walking

00:24:08.010 --> 00:24:10.066 align:middle line:90%
down the hall on day.

00:24:10.066 --> 00:24:12.280 align:middle line:84%
And I don\'t know what type
of guy this was.

00:24:12.280 --> 00:24:13.610 align:middle line:90%
I can\'t remember his name.

00:24:13.610 --> 00:24:14.790 align:middle line:90%
But he come to me.

00:24:14.790 --> 00:24:17.070 align:middle line:84%
And he told me, some of the
guys told me you were

00:24:17.070 --> 00:24:19.290 align:middle line:90%
whistling at my sister.

00:24:19.290 --> 00:24:22.008 align:middle line:84%
And I say, what are
you talking about?

00:24:22.008 --> 00:24:26.630 align:middle line:84%
He\'s like, you can\'t
be doing that.

00:24:26.630 --> 00:24:29.340 align:middle line:84%
And I said, man, I don\'t
even know your sister.

00:24:29.340 --> 00:24:31.626 align:middle line:84%
Well, that\'s what
they told me.

00:24:31.626 --> 00:24:33.930 align:middle line:84%
And you know, stuff
like that went on.

00:24:33.930 --> 00:24:35.556 align:middle line:90%
And I didn\'t know his sister.

00:24:35.556 --> 00:24:37.040 align:middle line:84%
I didn\'t know who he
was talking about.

00:24:37.040 --> 00:24:39.370 align:middle line:84%
Somebody was just putting him
up to try to get him to get

00:24:39.370 --> 00:24:42.970 align:middle line:90%
into a fight with me now.

00:24:42.970 --> 00:24:46.990 align:middle line:84%
I was very much aware of
the Carter family\'s

00:24:46.990 --> 00:24:49.100 align:middle line:90%
presence from day one.

00:24:49.100 --> 00:24:50.680 align:middle line:90%
The school was small.

00:24:50.680 --> 00:24:53.956 align:middle line:84%
You passed each other
in the halls.

00:24:53.956 --> 00:24:58.390 align:middle line:90%
I say how they were treated.

00:24:58.390 --> 00:25:02.890 align:middle line:84%
And I saw the sadness and
isolation on their faces.

00:25:02.890 --> 00:25:04.325 align:middle line:84%
And then it got so bad
in the cafeteria.

00:25:04.325 --> 00:25:06.080 align:middle line:84%
And I don\'t think they wanted
to sit at the same table.

00:25:06.080 --> 00:25:07.430 align:middle line:84%
They didn\'t want to sit
on the same aisle.

00:25:07.430 --> 00:25:09.470 align:middle line:84%
They had four or five
tables lined up.

00:25:09.470 --> 00:25:10.590 align:middle line:84%
They didn\'t even want to
sit on that aisle.

00:25:10.590 --> 00:25:12.330 align:middle line:84%
If you sat on that aisle,
they\'d all get

00:25:12.330 --> 00:25:13.000 align:middle line:90%
on the other aisles.

00:25:13.000 --> 00:25:14.510 align:middle line:84%
I don\'t even want to
think about lunch

00:25:14.510 --> 00:25:16.980 align:middle line:90%
time at that school.

00:25:16.980 --> 00:25:18.480 align:middle line:84%
You couldn\'t sit nowhere
because the

00:25:18.480 --> 00:25:21.310 align:middle line:90%
cafeteria would be full.

00:25:21.310 --> 00:25:24.410 align:middle line:84%
And then when you do sit,
everybody scatters, like a

00:25:24.410 --> 00:25:27.210 align:middle line:90%
bomb just went on.

00:25:27.210 --> 00:25:30.850 align:middle line:84%
And why would you want to go
through that every day?

00:25:30.850 --> 00:25:32.124 align:middle line:90%
I just didn\'t want to do it.

00:25:32.124 --> 00:25:34.850 align:middle line:90%

00:25:34.850 --> 00:25:37.390 align:middle line:84%
You line up like you do
in any cafeteria.

00:25:37.390 --> 00:25:41.900 align:middle line:84%
And I was at the end of the
line to collect the money.

00:25:41.900 --> 00:25:47.440 align:middle line:84%
And they would come through
and be served one by one.

00:25:47.440 --> 00:25:51.370 align:middle line:84%
And the white children and
go and sit down and eat.

00:25:51.370 --> 00:25:53.780 align:middle line:84%
And the little black children
would take their lunch, throw

00:25:53.780 --> 00:25:56.370 align:middle line:84%
it in the garbage, and
then go outside.

00:25:56.370 --> 00:25:58.180 align:middle line:90%
No matter how cold it got--

00:25:58.180 --> 00:26:00.890 align:middle line:84%
and sometimes it would cold,
like zero degrees--

00:26:00.890 --> 00:26:03.500 align:middle line:84%
we always went to our
same spot outside.

00:26:03.500 --> 00:26:05.490 align:middle line:90%
We never wanted to go inside.

00:26:05.490 --> 00:26:08.720 align:middle line:84%
So we would sit there on those
steps in zero degree weather.

00:26:08.720 --> 00:26:09.960 align:middle line:84%
It was too painful to eat
in the cafeteria.

00:26:09.960 --> 00:26:13.370 align:middle line:84%
I think out of all the years I
was at Drew High School, from

00:26:13.370 --> 00:26:15.230 align:middle line:84%
the 7th through the 11th grade,
I probably ate in that

00:26:15.230 --> 00:26:16.190 align:middle line:90%
cafeteria twice.

00:26:16.190 --> 00:26:18.140 align:middle line:90%
We\'d go hungry all day long.

00:26:18.140 --> 00:26:19.010 align:middle line:90%
Because we didn\'t want to eat.

00:26:19.010 --> 00:26:20.710 align:middle line:84%
We\'d just go sit on the
steps rather than eat.

00:26:20.710 --> 00:26:31.970 align:middle line:90%

00:26:31.970 --> 00:26:36.600 align:middle line:84%
When I looked upon Deborah and
Beverly Carter, those were the

00:26:36.600 --> 00:26:38.780 align:middle line:84%
ones who were closest
to me in grade.

00:26:38.780 --> 00:26:43.580 align:middle line:84%
Deborah started school the first
year my sister Janelle

00:26:43.580 --> 00:26:46.260 align:middle line:84%
did, which was when I was
in the second grade.

00:26:46.260 --> 00:26:49.800 align:middle line:84%
And Beverly would have been
a grade ahead of me.

00:26:49.800 --> 00:26:52.300 align:middle line:84%
And so we were in pretty close
contact with these girls.

00:26:52.300 --> 00:26:54.300 align:middle line:84%
And they would be very
sad at recess.

00:26:54.300 --> 00:27:00.050 align:middle line:84%
And we would observe the
taunting, and name-calling,

00:27:00.050 --> 00:27:03.040 align:middle line:84%
and degrading that they
went through.

00:27:03.040 --> 00:27:05.870 align:middle line:84%
And many times, my sister
and I would go.

00:27:05.870 --> 00:27:09.160 align:middle line:84%
And they would be alone against
the wall, standing.

00:27:09.160 --> 00:27:12.990 align:middle line:84%
Or maybe even the little sister,
Deborah, would cry and

00:27:12.990 --> 00:27:15.570 align:middle line:84%
be upset because some bully
had pushed her or said

00:27:15.570 --> 00:27:17.060 align:middle line:90%
something really ugly.

00:27:17.060 --> 00:27:20.115 align:middle line:84%
And Beverly and her would be
trying to comfort one another.

00:27:20.115 --> 00:27:23.980 align:middle line:84%
And I know of more than once
that my sister and I went over

00:27:23.980 --> 00:27:28.530 align:middle line:84%
to befriend them and to talk
to them, because our hearts

00:27:28.530 --> 00:27:29.280 align:middle line:90%
went out to them.

00:27:29.280 --> 00:27:31.250 align:middle line:84%
Because they were
people like us.

00:27:31.250 --> 00:27:32.940 align:middle line:84%
They were just little girls
in the first and

00:27:32.940 --> 00:27:35.810 align:middle line:90%
second grade, like us.

00:27:35.810 --> 00:27:40.730 align:middle line:84%
One day, some of the other white
children needed somebody

00:27:40.730 --> 00:27:42.370 align:middle line:84%
to throw the jump
rope for them.

00:27:42.370 --> 00:27:46.656 align:middle line:84%
I thought that maybe I could get
to jump rope, that I was

00:27:46.656 --> 00:27:49.605 align:middle line:84%
going to have somebody to play
with that day, that recess.

00:27:49.605 --> 00:27:52.325 align:middle line:84%
But I found out they just wanted
me to throw the rope.

00:27:52.325 --> 00:28:04.750 align:middle line:90%

00:28:04.750 --> 00:28:07.030 align:middle line:84%
Just a lot of things
that happened, when

00:28:07.030 --> 00:28:08.440 align:middle line:90%
you think about it.

00:28:08.440 --> 00:28:10.720 align:middle line:90%
And it wasn\'t just children.

00:28:10.720 --> 00:28:16.290 align:middle line:84%
It was the adults sitting
there, seeing it happen.

00:28:16.290 --> 00:28:18.840 align:middle line:84%
And they didn\'t try to do
anything about it, didn\'t try

00:28:18.840 --> 00:28:20.410 align:middle line:84%
to tell the children that
you don\'t treat

00:28:20.410 --> 00:28:23.260 align:middle line:90%
other people that way.

00:28:23.260 --> 00:28:30.100 align:middle line:84%
They more or less condoned
it and said it was OK.

00:28:30.100 --> 00:28:34.140 align:middle line:84%
And it made us feel
less than people.

00:28:34.140 --> 00:28:37.190 align:middle line:90%

00:28:37.190 --> 00:28:42.860 align:middle line:84%
I had a real mean teacher my
first year at AW James.

00:28:42.860 --> 00:28:48.380 align:middle line:84%
And I felt like she had a lot
to do with the way the kids

00:28:48.380 --> 00:28:51.490 align:middle line:90%
reacted to me.

00:28:51.490 --> 00:29:00.880 align:middle line:84%
She decided that each kids
should not sit by me no more

00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:03.380 align:middle line:90%
than one week at a time.

00:29:03.380 --> 00:29:08.810 align:middle line:84%
So every week she would change
the child in front of

00:29:08.810 --> 00:29:11.100 align:middle line:90%
me and behind me.

00:29:11.100 --> 00:29:13.850 align:middle line:84%
She would take them
out in the hall.

00:29:13.850 --> 00:29:16.880 align:middle line:84%
When they\'d get back into the
room, the one in front of me

00:29:16.880 --> 00:29:20.490 align:middle line:84%
would pull their chair
way in front.

00:29:20.490 --> 00:29:24.030 align:middle line:84%
And the one behind me would
pull theirs away from me.

00:29:24.030 --> 00:29:27.110 align:middle line:84%
They just happened to
be the ones who--

00:29:27.110 --> 00:29:30.840 align:middle line:90%

00:29:30.840 --> 00:29:33.070 align:middle line:84%
I don\'t really know the word
I want to use here.

00:29:33.070 --> 00:29:35.700 align:middle line:90%
It\'s not a pawn.

00:29:35.700 --> 00:29:39.220 align:middle line:84%
The instrument, maybe, for
integrating the school system.

00:29:39.220 --> 00:29:42.330 align:middle line:90%

00:29:42.330 --> 00:29:45.180 align:middle line:84%
I don\'t know how much damage
it did to them.

00:29:45.180 --> 00:29:47.970 align:middle line:84%
It didn\'t do any damage, as
far as I\'m personally

00:29:47.970 --> 00:29:51.010 align:middle line:84%
concerned, to anybody
that I knew.

00:29:51.010 --> 00:29:54.540 align:middle line:90%
Segregation was so complete.

00:29:54.540 --> 00:30:00.720 align:middle line:84%
There was not a bridge between
my world and theirs.

00:30:00.720 --> 00:30:02.750 align:middle line:90%
There was a wall.

00:30:02.750 --> 00:30:07.540 align:middle line:84%
And there was a wall that I
could not break through to.

00:30:07.540 --> 00:30:11.210 align:middle line:84%
Should have in some way, knowing
in myself that what I

00:30:11.210 --> 00:30:15.920 align:middle line:84%
was seeing and experiencing was
wrong, what was happening

00:30:15.920 --> 00:30:18.660 align:middle line:90%
was wrong, but did not.

00:30:18.660 --> 00:30:24.970 align:middle line:90%

00:30:24.970 --> 00:30:29.060 align:middle line:84%
Just saw these things
happening.

00:30:29.060 --> 00:30:33.803 align:middle line:84%
And did not take any
responsibility in it, you

00:30:33.803 --> 00:30:35.070 align:middle line:90%
know, went on with my life.

00:30:35.070 --> 00:30:38.400 align:middle line:90%

00:30:38.400 --> 00:30:43.100 align:middle line:84%
Before I went to that school, I
didn\'t think too much about

00:30:43.100 --> 00:30:45.980 align:middle line:90%
white people, period.

00:30:45.980 --> 00:30:47.910 align:middle line:84%
They all looked alike
to me at that time.

00:30:47.910 --> 00:30:49.250 align:middle line:84%
I didn\'t think nothing
about them.

00:30:49.250 --> 00:30:51.250 align:middle line:90%
They just existed, you know.

00:30:51.250 --> 00:30:54.190 align:middle line:84%
They went their way
and I went mine.

00:30:54.190 --> 00:30:59.820 align:middle line:84%
I can\'t remember hurting
as much about this.

00:30:59.820 --> 00:31:03.620 align:middle line:84%
I do now when I think back about
how I was treated then.

00:31:03.620 --> 00:31:04.420 align:middle line:90%
I don\'t know.

00:31:04.420 --> 00:31:06.370 align:middle line:84%
But I know when we used to come
home, though, and talk

00:31:06.370 --> 00:31:10.430 align:middle line:84%
about it, I know Mama would
say to us, it\'s wrong.

00:31:10.430 --> 00:31:12.530 align:middle line:84%
And they shouldn\'t be doing
this, and stuff like that.

00:31:12.530 --> 00:31:15.880 align:middle line:90%
But this is to be expected.

00:31:15.880 --> 00:31:17.040 align:middle line:90%
But you can\'t give up.

00:31:17.040 --> 00:31:19.092 align:middle line:90%
You have to keep going back.

00:31:19.092 --> 00:31:22.460 align:middle line:84%
To try to remember why we were
there, why we chose to go

00:31:22.460 --> 00:31:23.880 align:middle line:90%
there in the first place.

00:31:23.880 --> 00:31:27.360 align:middle line:84%
And I guess me being eight
years old, I still didn\'t

00:31:27.360 --> 00:31:30.700 align:middle line:84%
quite understand, like
I do now, what

00:31:30.700 --> 00:31:32.720 align:middle line:90%
she was talking about.

00:31:32.720 --> 00:31:36.220 align:middle line:84%
But I understand now what she
meant about what we were

00:31:36.220 --> 00:31:38.250 align:middle line:90%
doing, how important it was.

00:31:38.250 --> 00:31:43.410 align:middle line:84%
It\'s hard for me to say what
the emotions are like.

00:31:43.410 --> 00:31:44.325 align:middle line:90%
I\'m sure they\'re there.

00:31:44.325 --> 00:31:46.730 align:middle line:84%
But it\'s hard to say
what they are.

00:31:46.730 --> 00:31:54.000 align:middle line:84%
Angry, sad, sick, depressed,
everything, all that.

00:31:54.000 --> 00:32:14.490 align:middle line:90%

00:32:14.490 --> 00:32:15.420 align:middle line:90%
It\'s freedom of choice.

00:32:15.420 --> 00:32:16.530 align:middle line:90%
You can do it.

00:32:16.530 --> 00:32:18.920 align:middle line:84%
But you\'re going to have
to be ready to face the

00:32:18.920 --> 00:32:20.040 align:middle line:90%
consequences.

00:32:20.040 --> 00:32:21.475 align:middle line:90%
And I guess Mama new that.

00:32:21.475 --> 00:32:21.860 align:middle line:90%
I didn\'t.

00:32:21.860 --> 00:32:25.650 align:middle line:84%
I mean, I didn\'t know that
it was like, you can go.

00:32:25.650 --> 00:32:27.640 align:middle line:84%
But you\'re all going to face
some consequences.

00:32:27.640 --> 00:32:30.123 align:middle line:84%
I wasn\'t old enough to know
the consequences that were

00:32:30.123 --> 00:32:31.600 align:middle line:84%
going to come with
that decision.

00:32:31.600 --> 00:32:32.390 align:middle line:90%
She probably did.

00:32:32.390 --> 00:32:33.870 align:middle line:84%
Because she knew what
else was going on.

00:32:33.870 --> 00:32:34.820 align:middle line:90%
People were being hung.

00:32:34.820 --> 00:32:36.170 align:middle line:84%
And people were being
thrown in the river.

00:32:36.170 --> 00:32:38.770 align:middle line:84%
And people were being buried,
and all those kinds of things,

00:32:38.770 --> 00:32:39.960 align:middle line:90%
but trying to do something.

00:32:39.960 --> 00:32:42.470 align:middle line:84%
So I\'m sure she probably was
aware that there were going to

00:32:42.470 --> 00:32:44.820 align:middle line:84%
be some consequences behind
this decision.

00:32:44.820 --> 00:32:47.290 align:middle line:90%
But she did it anyway.

00:32:47.290 --> 00:32:52.000 align:middle line:84%
When you live out on a farm
and a plantation, the

00:32:52.000 --> 00:32:55.060 align:middle line:84%
plantation owner think
he own you.

00:32:55.060 --> 00:32:58.510 align:middle line:84%
Body and soul, he
just own you.

00:32:58.510 --> 00:33:03.590 align:middle line:84%
And you got a right to come to
him and ask what you should do

00:33:03.590 --> 00:33:06.240 align:middle line:90%
and what you should not do.

00:33:06.240 --> 00:33:09.250 align:middle line:90%
So we didn\'t do that.

00:33:09.250 --> 00:33:11.930 align:middle line:84%
So early the next morning, I
said we had to enroll the kids

00:33:11.930 --> 00:33:14.210 align:middle line:90%
into the school.

00:33:14.210 --> 00:33:20.040 align:middle line:84%
Here come the overseer, blowing
the horn on his car,

00:33:20.040 --> 00:33:25.122 align:middle line:84%
on his truck, for my husband
to come out.

00:33:25.122 --> 00:33:31.080 align:middle line:84%
And my husband went on out there
and was talking to him.

00:33:31.080 --> 00:33:35.360 align:middle line:84%
And I heard him telling my
husband by how shocked he was.

00:33:35.360 --> 00:33:39.440 align:middle line:84%
He was shocked that we had
enrolled our children into

00:33:39.440 --> 00:33:41.810 align:middle line:90%
that school.

00:33:41.810 --> 00:33:49.920 align:middle line:84%
So he told Matthew that he\'d
give him time to come in the

00:33:49.920 --> 00:33:53.510 align:middle line:90%
house to talk to me about it.

00:33:53.510 --> 00:33:55.230 align:middle line:90%
And he said, Mr. [INAUDIBLE]

00:33:55.230 --> 00:34:00.210 align:middle line:84%
wants me to go out there to
the school and withdraw my

00:34:00.210 --> 00:34:01.470 align:middle line:90%
children out.

00:34:01.470 --> 00:34:05.188 align:middle line:84%
And he said he would
go with me.

00:34:05.188 --> 00:34:08.820 align:middle line:90%
I said, you go back out there.

00:34:08.820 --> 00:34:11.060 align:middle line:90%
And you tell Mr. [INAUDIBLE]

00:34:11.060 --> 00:34:15.590 align:middle line:84%
he cannot tell me what school
to send my children to.

00:34:15.590 --> 00:34:20.280 align:middle line:84%
And I would be crazy trying to
tell him what school to send

00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:23.571 align:middle line:90%
his kids to.

00:34:23.571 --> 00:34:28.370 align:middle line:84%
The next night, here come the
pickup trucks and things

00:34:28.370 --> 00:34:30.419 align:middle line:90%
coming in there.

00:34:30.419 --> 00:34:32.160 align:middle line:84%
And my husband was up
for something, to

00:34:32.160 --> 00:34:34.969 align:middle line:90%
see about the baby.

00:34:34.969 --> 00:34:36.750 align:middle line:84%
And he said, what are
all these cars

00:34:36.750 --> 00:34:38.620 align:middle line:90%
doing coming in here?

00:34:38.620 --> 00:34:42.469 align:middle line:90%
It\'s 3 o\'clock in the morning.

00:34:42.469 --> 00:34:45.739 align:middle line:84%
And then he said, oh, they\'re
shooting out there.

00:34:45.739 --> 00:34:48.960 align:middle line:90%
They\'re shooting.

00:34:48.960 --> 00:34:52.414 align:middle line:84%
And they shot all on top of the
house and on the porch.

00:34:52.414 --> 00:34:54.584 align:middle line:84%
And it was going like
popcorn popping.

00:34:54.584 --> 00:34:59.430 align:middle line:90%

00:34:59.430 --> 00:35:01.550 align:middle line:84%
So he told us to move
after then.

00:35:01.550 --> 00:35:04.450 align:middle line:84%
We didn\'t listen
to the bullets.

00:35:04.450 --> 00:35:06.400 align:middle line:90%
So he told us to move.

00:35:06.400 --> 00:35:10.090 align:middle line:90%

00:35:10.090 --> 00:35:12.150 align:middle line:84%
There was always going to
be freedom of choice.

00:35:12.150 --> 00:35:14.990 align:middle line:84%
And with freedom of choice,
the black people were not

00:35:14.990 --> 00:35:17.430 align:middle line:90%
going to make that choice.

00:35:17.430 --> 00:35:21.538 align:middle line:84%
They didn\'t want to have their
house shot into and they tried

00:35:21.538 --> 00:35:24.680 align:middle line:84%
to cut all the things
that happened to us.

00:35:24.680 --> 00:35:31.660 align:middle line:90%

00:35:31.660 --> 00:35:32.910 align:middle line:90%
Trying to hold slavery.

00:35:32.910 --> 00:35:37.705 align:middle line:90%

00:35:37.705 --> 00:35:38.640 align:middle line:90%
Why they--

00:35:38.640 --> 00:35:40.880 align:middle line:84%
they\'ll do anything to
try to hold slavery.

00:35:40.880 --> 00:35:43.736 align:middle line:90%

00:35:43.736 --> 00:36:10.070 align:middle line:90%
[MUSIC PLAYING]

00:36:10.070 --> 00:36:14.200 align:middle line:84%
Drew is located seven miles
south of Parchman

00:36:14.200 --> 00:36:16.090 align:middle line:90%
Penitentiary.

00:36:16.090 --> 00:36:20.870 align:middle line:84%
And it\'s four miles north of
Ruleville, where Miss Hamer

00:36:20.870 --> 00:36:22.660 align:middle line:90%
lived and worked.

00:36:22.660 --> 00:36:27.170 align:middle line:84%
And Ruleville is four miles
north of Doddsville, where

00:36:27.170 --> 00:36:32.030 align:middle line:84%
Senator Eastland had his
huge plantation.

00:36:32.030 --> 00:36:41.510 align:middle line:84%
And Drew sits in the middle of
that as a rural community

00:36:41.510 --> 00:36:42.760 align:middle line:90%
surrounded by plantations.

00:36:42.760 --> 00:36:45.190 align:middle line:90%

00:36:45.190 --> 00:36:51.090 align:middle line:84%
In the district continues to be
run by the same people who

00:36:51.090 --> 00:36:56.900 align:middle line:84%
ran it prior to the federal
court issuing its school

00:36:56.900 --> 00:37:02.810 align:middle line:84%
desegregation orders between
1969 and 1971.

00:37:02.810 --> 00:37:05.340 align:middle line:84%
Dick Noble, who is the attorney
for the School Board

00:37:05.340 --> 00:37:10.610 align:middle line:84%
now, was the attorney for the
School Board in the litigation

00:37:10.610 --> 00:37:15.820 align:middle line:84%
which Mae Bertha Carter brought
against the school

00:37:15.820 --> 00:37:20.470 align:middle line:84%
district to try to bring an end
to racial segregation in

00:37:20.470 --> 00:37:21.390 align:middle line:90%
the Drew schools.

00:37:21.390 --> 00:37:26.490 align:middle line:84%
And when Miss Carter took the
lead and started pressing to

00:37:26.490 --> 00:37:30.330 align:middle line:84%
get those doors open, it
was a great thing.

00:37:30.330 --> 00:37:35.610 align:middle line:84%
What has failed to happen is
for the black community to

00:37:35.610 --> 00:37:39.860 align:middle line:84%
actually feel what that
quality, what

00:37:39.860 --> 00:37:41.940 align:middle line:90%
that equity is like.

00:37:41.940 --> 00:37:47.760 align:middle line:84%
Because the moment that the
court said, you\'re right, we

00:37:47.760 --> 00:37:50.540 align:middle line:84%
need to have these children in
the same buildings, sharing

00:37:50.540 --> 00:37:54.570 align:middle line:84%
the same things, developing
the same tools, the white

00:37:54.570 --> 00:37:58.060 align:middle line:84%
community snatched their
children out, set up academies

00:37:58.060 --> 00:37:59.770 align:middle line:90%
all along the delta.

00:37:59.770 --> 00:38:03.280 align:middle line:84%
It\'s encompassed with academies,
separate schools.

00:38:03.280 --> 00:38:08.990 align:middle line:84%
So that they could continue to
have a separation in what

00:38:08.990 --> 00:38:11.060 align:middle line:90%
children are being taught.

00:38:11.060 --> 00:38:15.560 align:middle line:84%
You still today have public
education, which is

00:38:15.560 --> 00:38:19.680 align:middle line:84%
predominantly black, and private
education, which is

00:38:19.680 --> 00:38:21.420 align:middle line:90%
virtually all white.

00:38:21.420 --> 00:38:25.880 align:middle line:84%
The same separations in the
\'40s, \'50s, and \'60s

00:38:25.880 --> 00:38:27.070 align:middle line:90%
is still going on.

00:38:27.070 --> 00:38:28.320 align:middle line:84%
And we\'re in the
new millennium.

00:38:28.320 --> 00:38:35.850 align:middle line:90%

00:38:35.850 --> 00:39:20.400 align:middle line:90%
[MUSIC PLAYING-- \"DIXIE\"]

00:39:20.400 --> 00:39:25.930 align:middle line:84%
The private academies came into
being once blacks entered

00:39:25.930 --> 00:39:28.360 align:middle line:90%
the public schools.

00:39:28.360 --> 00:39:32.010 align:middle line:84%
And throughout the South,
that was the South\'s

00:39:32.010 --> 00:39:34.740 align:middle line:90%
answer to no, never.

00:39:34.740 --> 00:39:37.080 align:middle line:90%
We\'ll never integrate.

00:39:37.080 --> 00:39:41.590 align:middle line:84%
These were the people who would
not hear the federal

00:39:41.590 --> 00:39:42.900 align:middle line:90%
government.

00:39:42.900 --> 00:39:49.490 align:middle line:84%
This is, again, the same kind
of reluctant submission to

00:39:49.490 --> 00:39:56.366 align:middle line:84%
change that occurred after
the Civil War.

00:39:56.366 --> 00:40:03.450 align:middle line:84%
You just could not convince the
average white parent that

00:40:03.450 --> 00:40:07.940 align:middle line:84%
if they stuck it out in the
public school system and

00:40:07.940 --> 00:40:13.330 align:middle line:84%
worked to make it work that
not only would the public

00:40:13.330 --> 00:40:16.447 align:middle line:84%
school system and their children
benefit from it, but

00:40:16.447 --> 00:40:21.760 align:middle line:84%
the community as a whole would
benefit from having a viable,

00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:23.310 align:middle line:90%
good public school system.

00:40:23.310 --> 00:40:25.870 align:middle line:90%

00:40:25.870 --> 00:40:30.380 align:middle line:84%
In 1970, this school building,
North Sunflower Academy School

00:40:30.380 --> 00:40:33.460 align:middle line:84%
building that we\'re
in now, was built.

00:40:33.460 --> 00:40:36.600 align:middle line:84%
The school was 1st through
12th grade.

00:40:36.600 --> 00:40:39.470 align:middle line:84%
And people came from both
locations, from all around the

00:40:39.470 --> 00:40:42.800 align:middle line:84%
area, from north of here
and south of here.

00:40:42.800 --> 00:40:46.570 align:middle line:84%
It doesn\'t take a historian to
realize that in 1970, the Drew

00:40:46.570 --> 00:40:50.470 align:middle line:84%
schools were completely
desegregated.

00:40:50.470 --> 00:40:53.930 align:middle line:84%
This school, at that time,
was a reflection of that.

00:40:53.930 --> 00:40:59.440 align:middle line:84%
Without the support of the
white community, which

00:40:59.440 --> 00:41:05.899 align:middle line:84%
represented the vast majority of
your business leaders, your

00:41:05.899 --> 00:41:10.560 align:middle line:84%
lawyers, your doctors, and so
on and so forth, the school

00:41:10.560 --> 00:41:16.760 align:middle line:84%
system simply collapsed
without that support.

00:41:16.760 --> 00:41:21.280 align:middle line:84%
During the time when the school
was being integrated,

00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:23.010 align:middle line:90%
the white kids were leaving.

00:41:23.010 --> 00:41:27.280 align:middle line:84%
The teachers that we
had were leaving.

00:41:27.280 --> 00:41:30.310 align:middle line:84%
A lot of the curriculum
changed.

00:41:30.310 --> 00:41:32.730 align:middle line:84%
You noticed a difference
as far as the

00:41:32.730 --> 00:41:35.670 align:middle line:90%
caliber of what was offered.

00:41:35.670 --> 00:41:41.550 align:middle line:84%
By the time I was a senior,
there were just 26 of us.

00:41:41.550 --> 00:41:47.610 align:middle line:84%
And it was hard to even get
advanced chemistry or

00:41:47.610 --> 00:41:49.410 align:middle line:90%
trigonometry.

00:41:49.410 --> 00:41:51.790 align:middle line:84%
We couldn\'t even get enough
people together to

00:41:51.790 --> 00:41:54.540 align:middle line:90%
get a class for that.

00:41:54.540 --> 00:41:55.790 align:middle line:90%
We didn\'t have prom.

00:41:55.790 --> 00:41:59.430 align:middle line:90%

00:41:59.430 --> 00:42:01.800 align:middle line:84%
We couldn\'t have dances
at the school.

00:42:01.800 --> 00:42:04.800 align:middle line:84%
There was a few white
students there.

00:42:04.800 --> 00:42:08.050 align:middle line:84%
They could get asked out
by a black person.

00:42:08.050 --> 00:42:11.130 align:middle line:84%
And then they would have an
integrated couple at the prom.

00:42:11.130 --> 00:42:16.290 align:middle line:84%
I think the reason of all that
was the reason it stopped.

00:42:16.290 --> 00:42:21.100 align:middle line:84%
We went to school on the first
day and really were amazed

00:42:21.100 --> 00:42:28.985 align:middle line:84%
because no friends at all that I
had ever known and gone from

00:42:28.985 --> 00:42:33.030 align:middle line:84%
the first grade up
were in my class.

00:42:33.030 --> 00:42:42.120 align:middle line:84%
I was the only white person in
a full to capacity classroom.

00:42:42.120 --> 00:42:46.180 align:middle line:84%
And went the whole first day
of school without seeing a

00:42:46.180 --> 00:42:52.010 align:middle line:84%
single white person
besides myself.

00:42:52.010 --> 00:42:55.690 align:middle line:84%
And that was a very strange
and scary feeling.

00:42:55.690 --> 00:43:01.860 align:middle line:84%
Not scary because of what people
did to me or said to me

00:43:01.860 --> 00:43:11.690 align:middle line:84%
but because I was the only
person who was different there

00:43:11.690 --> 00:43:15.330 align:middle line:90%
in the way of being white.

00:43:15.330 --> 00:43:20.060 align:middle line:84%
And I knew something immediately
the first day.

00:43:20.060 --> 00:43:27.480 align:middle line:84%
The very first day, I knew how
it felt to be Beverly or

00:43:27.480 --> 00:43:29.280 align:middle line:90%
Deborah Carter.

00:43:29.280 --> 00:43:32.450 align:middle line:90%
White flight just took place.

00:43:32.450 --> 00:43:37.540 align:middle line:84%
And over the years, nothing
seems to have changed.

00:43:37.540 --> 00:43:40.950 align:middle line:84%
The courts said, yeah, you
will be fully integrated.

00:43:40.950 --> 00:43:45.740 align:middle line:84%
Then the white people
took flight.

00:43:45.740 --> 00:43:47.770 align:middle line:84%
And they flew to
the academies.

00:43:47.770 --> 00:43:49.770 align:middle line:90%
And they\'re still there.

00:43:49.770 --> 00:43:51.430 align:middle line:84%
And that\'s where they\'re
going to be.

00:43:51.430 --> 00:43:54.205 align:middle line:84%
We\'re co-existing in two
different worlds.

00:43:54.205 --> 00:43:57.110 align:middle line:90%

00:43:57.110 --> 00:44:03.310 align:middle line:84%
We live in a community here
where two of the people

00:44:03.310 --> 00:44:10.300 align:middle line:84%
serving on our School Board have
been serving since before

00:44:10.300 --> 00:44:13.910 align:middle line:84%
Mae Bertha Carter\'s
family fight to

00:44:13.910 --> 00:44:15.970 align:middle line:90%
integrate the school system.

00:44:15.970 --> 00:44:20.180 align:middle line:84%
William DuBard, who\'s serving
as chair now, has served as

00:44:20.180 --> 00:44:23.940 align:middle line:84%
chair for some 27
years or more.

00:44:23.940 --> 00:44:29.930 align:middle line:84%
He served as a School Board
member for some 34, 35 years.

00:44:29.930 --> 00:44:34.290 align:middle line:84%
You have on there John
Quincy West, who\'s

00:44:34.290 --> 00:44:36.650 align:middle line:90%
running, I think, 32 years.

00:44:36.650 --> 00:44:39.630 align:middle line:84%
So that makes him three years
behind William DuBard.

00:44:39.630 --> 00:44:45.740 align:middle line:84%
And these people\'s values, and
the culture, and the race

00:44:45.740 --> 00:44:48.610 align:middle line:84%
which they support
has not changed.

00:44:48.610 --> 00:44:52.890 align:middle line:84%
Mr. DuBard, I think, had a lot
to do with the quality of

00:44:52.890 --> 00:44:58.190 align:middle line:84%
education and how it
has deteriorated.

00:44:58.190 --> 00:45:02.290 align:middle line:84%
If your child is not in that
school system, why would you

00:45:02.290 --> 00:45:04.390 align:middle line:84%
even want to be on that
School Board?

00:45:04.390 --> 00:45:07.490 align:middle line:84%
I think it\'s about keeping
the hand in the pot,

00:45:07.490 --> 00:45:09.440 align:middle line:90%
whatever the pot is.

00:45:09.440 --> 00:45:12.510 align:middle line:84%
We tried to discover what that
was with the Drew Concerned

00:45:12.510 --> 00:45:13.330 align:middle line:90%
Citizens Group.

00:45:13.330 --> 00:45:15.350 align:middle line:84%
But many, many doors
were closed.

00:45:15.350 --> 00:45:20.240 align:middle line:84%
Many mysteries were
kept mysterious.

00:45:20.240 --> 00:45:25.270 align:middle line:84%
And we had many questions about
how 16th section land

00:45:25.270 --> 00:45:28.490 align:middle line:84%
monies and different things were
being used in different

00:45:28.490 --> 00:45:30.900 align:middle line:84%
situations that always
seemed to be a

00:45:30.900 --> 00:45:33.690 align:middle line:90%
mystery, and still are.

00:45:33.690 --> 00:45:38.350 align:middle line:84%
From years and before slavery
ended, they sit down and they

00:45:38.350 --> 00:45:42.750 align:middle line:84%
say, well, OK, they\'re going
to be free but they won\'t

00:45:42.750 --> 00:45:44.830 align:middle line:90%
compete with us for jobs.

00:45:44.830 --> 00:45:49.360 align:middle line:84%
So it was never designed for
the blacks to be educated.

00:45:49.360 --> 00:45:51.380 align:middle line:84%
So we got to mix it
up somewhere.

00:45:51.380 --> 00:45:54.210 align:middle line:84%
And it goes on today
through people like

00:45:54.210 --> 00:45:57.200 align:middle line:90%
DuBard and Q. West.

00:45:57.200 --> 00:45:59.360 align:middle line:84%
What other reason are those
two people sitting there?

00:45:59.360 --> 00:46:03.210 align:middle line:84%
We\'ve asked those men face to
face, why are you sitting on

00:46:03.210 --> 00:46:04.010 align:middle line:90%
this board?

00:46:04.010 --> 00:46:06.370 align:middle line:84%
Why do you want to be
over our children?

00:46:06.370 --> 00:46:07.500 align:middle line:90%
What is your interest?

00:46:07.500 --> 00:46:08.950 align:middle line:90%
They couldn\'t give answers.

00:46:08.950 --> 00:46:10.730 align:middle line:84%
There are people in this world
that think that they\'re

00:46:10.730 --> 00:46:13.970 align:middle line:84%
superior, and that they are
supposed to be superior, and

00:46:13.970 --> 00:46:15.740 align:middle line:84%
you\'re supposed to be
servants to them.

00:46:15.740 --> 00:46:17.480 align:middle line:84%
You\'re supposed to be less
than them, and look up to

00:46:17.480 --> 00:46:19.190 align:middle line:90%
them, and serve them.

00:46:19.190 --> 00:46:20.380 align:middle line:90%
That came from slavery.

00:46:20.380 --> 00:46:21.790 align:middle line:84%
I mean, we were brought
over here as slaves.

00:46:21.790 --> 00:46:23.700 align:middle line:84%
And we were supposed to
be less than human.

00:46:23.700 --> 00:46:25.060 align:middle line:84%
And we were here
to serve them.

00:46:25.060 --> 00:46:28.030 align:middle line:84%
And I tell my son, well,
we fought that.

00:46:28.030 --> 00:46:30.760 align:middle line:84%
Because if we hadn\'t fought, if
somebody hadn\'t stepped up

00:46:30.760 --> 00:46:33.080 align:middle line:84%
to fight, we\'d still
be slaves today.

00:46:33.080 --> 00:46:34.996 align:middle line:84%
They weren\'t going to say,
OK, we\'re tired of

00:46:34.996 --> 00:46:35.780 align:middle line:90%
you all being slaves.

00:46:35.780 --> 00:46:36.600 align:middle line:90%
That\'s wrong.

00:46:36.600 --> 00:46:38.050 align:middle line:84%
We\'re going to do away
with slavery.

00:46:38.050 --> 00:46:39.940 align:middle line:84%
Somebody had to step
up and say, no.

00:46:39.940 --> 00:46:42.600 align:middle line:90%
We\'re not taking this anymore.

00:46:42.600 --> 00:46:49.700 align:middle line:84%
Martin Luther King said, you
ought to have something that

00:46:49.700 --> 00:46:50.950 align:middle line:90%
you\'re willing to die for.

00:46:50.950 --> 00:46:56.880 align:middle line:90%

00:46:56.880 --> 00:46:58.505 align:middle line:84%
Live in this world, and
talk about they\'re

00:46:58.505 --> 00:47:00.540 align:middle line:90%
going to kill you.

00:47:00.540 --> 00:47:01.770 align:middle line:90%
They sure will.

00:47:01.770 --> 00:47:05.750 align:middle line:84%
You\'re already dead if you let
them control your life.

00:47:05.750 --> 00:47:08.720 align:middle line:90%
You\'re already dead.

00:47:08.720 --> 00:47:12.980 align:middle line:84%
You don\'t have but
one time to die.

00:47:12.980 --> 00:48:12.850 align:middle line:90%
[MUSIC PLAYING]

00:48:12.850 --> 00:48:15.490 align:middle line:84%
I take a look at Drew and I
see a small town that is

00:48:15.490 --> 00:48:17.410 align:middle line:90%
sitting still, veritably.

00:48:17.410 --> 00:48:22.420 align:middle line:84%
And no manufacturing, no
look of the future.

00:48:22.420 --> 00:48:24.610 align:middle line:84%
In fact, if I was a young person
starting out with a

00:48:24.610 --> 00:48:29.880 align:middle line:84%
family right now, I would move
elsewhere because there is not

00:48:29.880 --> 00:48:33.090 align:middle line:90%
room for advancement here.

00:48:33.090 --> 00:48:38.905 align:middle line:84%
The lack of jobs and the poverty
level in Sunflower

00:48:38.905 --> 00:48:43.870 align:middle line:84%
county, especially, maybe,
Drew, plays a lot in the

00:48:43.870 --> 00:48:45.150 align:middle line:90%
importance of education.

00:48:45.150 --> 00:48:47.400 align:middle line:90%
A lot of time, you can\'t see.

00:48:47.400 --> 00:48:49.880 align:middle line:84%
You know, you\'re struggling,
trying to make it, trying to

00:48:49.880 --> 00:48:54.850 align:middle line:84%
see the future and what, maybe,
that education can

00:48:54.850 --> 00:48:58.260 align:middle line:84%
bring you if you get a good
quality education.

00:48:58.260 --> 00:49:00.510 align:middle line:84%
So a lot of these people are
just struggling to make it

00:49:00.510 --> 00:49:03.200 align:middle line:90%
from one day to the next.

00:49:03.200 --> 00:49:06.060 align:middle line:84%
The kids that are left there
today, I just don\'t think they

00:49:06.060 --> 00:49:07.680 align:middle line:90%
got no future.

00:49:07.680 --> 00:49:10.440 align:middle line:84%
I don\'t think there\'s nothing
left there for them.

00:49:10.440 --> 00:49:14.390 align:middle line:84%
I think if one can get
out, they\'ll get out.

00:49:14.390 --> 00:49:16.840 align:middle line:84%
And the other ones are just
going to be stuck there.

00:49:16.840 --> 00:49:20.750 align:middle line:84%
I mean, there\'s no jobs,
really not a lot of

00:49:20.750 --> 00:49:23.110 align:middle line:90%
businesses.

00:49:23.110 --> 00:49:27.010 align:middle line:84%
I can\'t get from Moorhead to
[? Tuneville, ?] where the

00:49:27.010 --> 00:49:28.700 align:middle line:90%
next nearest job is.

00:49:28.700 --> 00:49:29.980 align:middle line:90%
Can\'t get there every day.

00:49:29.980 --> 00:49:32.410 align:middle line:90%
Don\'t have no ride.

00:49:32.410 --> 00:49:35.690 align:middle line:84%
I mean, then there\'s nothing to
do but get caught up in the

00:49:35.690 --> 00:49:36.300 align:middle line:90%
street life.

00:49:36.300 --> 00:49:40.020 align:middle line:84%
If you can\'t go to school every
morning or get up and go

00:49:40.020 --> 00:49:43.080 align:middle line:84%
to work every morning, what can
you do but get up and roam

00:49:43.080 --> 00:49:43.610 align:middle line:90%
the streets?

00:49:43.610 --> 00:49:46.350 align:middle line:90%
And who knows?

00:49:46.350 --> 00:49:49.640 align:middle line:84%
That\'s how it ends up for a lot
of people here in town.

00:49:49.640 --> 00:49:53.730 align:middle line:84%
When a kid gets suspended and
gets expelled from school,

00:49:53.730 --> 00:49:55.830 align:middle line:84%
they shouldn\'t expel or suspend
nobody from school.

00:49:55.830 --> 00:49:58.255 align:middle line:84%
They should have to come up with
some kind of program at

00:49:58.255 --> 00:50:00.050 align:middle line:84%
the end of school that
can help the kids

00:50:00.050 --> 00:50:01.010 align:middle line:90%
stay off the streets.

00:50:01.010 --> 00:50:03.645 align:middle line:84%
And that will lead them
to selling drugs.

00:50:03.645 --> 00:50:06.800 align:middle line:84%
That when they get suspended
and being out of school

00:50:06.800 --> 00:50:10.060 align:middle line:84%
drinking and hanging around
their friends, doing all kinds

00:50:10.060 --> 00:50:12.090 align:middle line:84%
of robbing houses,
and all that.

00:50:12.090 --> 00:50:14.030 align:middle line:90%
It leads to drugs.

00:50:14.030 --> 00:50:21.130 align:middle line:84%
Students who drop out at
Drew High School will

00:50:21.130 --> 00:50:23.180 align:middle line:90%
either leave this area.

00:50:23.180 --> 00:50:27.490 align:middle line:84%
If they stay in this area, they
will a lot of times get

00:50:27.490 --> 00:50:28.605 align:middle line:90%
in trouble.

00:50:28.605 --> 00:50:31.680 align:middle line:84%
About seven and a half miles
from here, we have the state

00:50:31.680 --> 00:50:32.430 align:middle line:90%
penitentiary.

00:50:32.430 --> 00:50:36.040 align:middle line:84%
And unfortunately, a lot of our
students who drop out and

00:50:36.040 --> 00:50:39.145 align:middle line:84%
who choose to say in this
area end up in the state

00:50:39.145 --> 00:50:40.395 align:middle line:90%
penitentiary.

00:50:40.395 --> 00:50:54.370 align:middle line:90%

00:50:54.370 --> 00:50:58.850 align:middle line:84%
If you look at the incarceration
rate in Parchman

00:50:58.850 --> 00:51:02.860 align:middle line:84%
and in county jails of
teenagers, black male

00:51:02.860 --> 00:51:06.800 align:middle line:84%
teenagers, not girls, black male
teenagers, and you look

00:51:06.800 --> 00:51:11.470 align:middle line:84%
at the dropout rates in the
public schools, the numbers

00:51:11.470 --> 00:51:13.710 align:middle line:90%
were startlingly similar.

00:51:13.710 --> 00:51:17.830 align:middle line:84%
So that you realize, a lot of
these kids that were out of

00:51:17.830 --> 00:51:22.210 align:middle line:84%
school were standing around on
street corners and were being

00:51:22.210 --> 00:51:23.550 align:middle line:90%
incarcerated.

00:51:23.550 --> 00:51:27.680 align:middle line:84%
And the whole business of
incarceration has ceased to be

00:51:27.680 --> 00:51:30.820 align:middle line:84%
punishment and has become an
industry that has taken on a

00:51:30.820 --> 00:51:32.740 align:middle line:90%
life of its own.

00:51:32.740 --> 00:51:36.620 align:middle line:84%
I went to work for corrections
in 1975.

00:51:36.620 --> 00:51:40.240 align:middle line:84%
And at that time, we had
approximately 1,700 offenders

00:51:40.240 --> 00:51:41.420 align:middle line:90%
in the system.

00:51:41.420 --> 00:51:44.100 align:middle line:84%
And last year when we
appropriated monies for the

00:51:44.100 --> 00:51:48.560 align:middle line:84%
Department of Corrections, we
appropriated $240 million for

00:51:48.560 --> 00:51:53.030 align:middle line:84%
some 18,000 offenders
to be incarcerated.

00:51:53.030 --> 00:51:57.090 align:middle line:84%
While at the same time, we have
not seen monies growing

00:51:57.090 --> 00:52:00.150 align:middle line:90%
at that level for education.

00:52:00.150 --> 00:52:04.800 align:middle line:84%
Mississippi State Penitentiary
here in Sunflower county

00:52:04.800 --> 00:52:09.550 align:middle line:84%
receives over $60 million from
the state legislator to manage

00:52:09.550 --> 00:52:10.990 align:middle line:90%
its facility.

00:52:10.990 --> 00:52:14.300 align:middle line:84%
And you go to Mississippi Valley
State University, or

00:52:14.300 --> 00:52:17.070 align:middle line:84%
the other State University, and
we would not give them $20

00:52:17.070 --> 00:52:20.510 align:middle line:84%
million to manage
their operation.

00:52:20.510 --> 00:52:26.390 align:middle line:84%
Now we know from the studies
that the more education, the

00:52:26.390 --> 00:52:29.810 align:middle line:84%
less likely you\'re going to
be winding up in prison.

00:52:29.810 --> 00:52:33.320 align:middle line:84%
The more wealth, the less likely
you\'re going to be

00:52:33.320 --> 00:52:36.040 align:middle line:90%
winding up in prison.

00:52:36.040 --> 00:52:39.300 align:middle line:84%
Do I hear a familiar
connection?

00:52:39.300 --> 00:52:45.370 align:middle line:84%
The education system becomes
the fork in the road.

00:52:45.370 --> 00:52:48.790 align:middle line:84%
You got to drive out a
percentage of the population

00:52:48.790 --> 00:52:55.760 align:middle line:84%
out of the school system into
a non-achieving, goalless

00:52:55.760 --> 00:53:01.230 align:middle line:84%
framework in order to set up the
basis for the kids winding

00:53:01.230 --> 00:53:03.500 align:middle line:90%
up in the jailhouse.

00:53:03.500 --> 00:53:07.950 align:middle line:84%
If you turn this around, and the
education system begins to

00:53:07.950 --> 00:53:12.980 align:middle line:84%
function, and all these kids
begin to graduate and go on to

00:53:12.980 --> 00:53:16.815 align:middle line:84%
other education or jobs, who\'s
going to go into the prisons?

00:53:16.815 --> 00:53:21.190 align:middle line:90%

00:53:21.190 --> 00:53:23.330 align:middle line:84%
Now the basic message when
I talk to children

00:53:23.330 --> 00:53:25.540 align:middle line:90%
is to get an education.

00:53:25.540 --> 00:53:30.410 align:middle line:84%
I put more stress on that
than I do anything.

00:53:30.410 --> 00:53:34.158 align:middle line:84%
Because without an education,
you\'re nowhere.

00:53:34.158 --> 00:56:34.363 align:middle line:90%
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